http://affairspk.com/2008/06/19/off-the-record-18-june-2008/

Watch Ambassador Haqqani take down jazbaati rantings of ARY's Kashif Abbasi. A must watch for all the cyberjihadis who advocate attacking America.

Haqqani indeed B!tch slaped the guy left and right, up and down ARY's Kashif Abbasi sounded like a 16 teen year old teenager who didnt know jack i was anti Haqqani but seing the level of maturity and smartness in this man i must say i am very impressed and i like the guy, each and every thing this guy said was Valid.

So basically he is acknowledging and resigning to the fact that we are incapable of defending or even standing up to a wrong. Nobody, atleast not the sane members on PDF were arguing for bombing the US although some of the same emotional clowns who were arguing for retaliation will thump their fists in victory on this thread. When Mr.Haqqani has resigned himself to the fact that Pakistan is not an equal sovereign then he should just roll over as he seems to be doing. He is equating military power to national dignity and sovereignty. There are dozens of examples of countries who were not equal in power yet stood up to for their national sovereignty by taking a strong diplomatic stance. This representative of the US appointed by Pakistan in the US is only good for the arm twisting of Pakistani newsanchors and would be rubbing his nose in dirt in front of a third grade American diplomat. A severe diplomatic message is not equal to leaving the war on Terror or military retaliation.

Haqqani seems to be more upset about the way the media is covering this issue then about the actual loss of Pakistani life. I was hoping that he would have realized that this is how TV programs works (obliviating and playing on peoples passions) even in the US, i.e. Sean Hannity and Bill O Reilly on Fox News, Keith Olberman on MSNBC and Lou Dobbs on CNN etc.

The jist of Mr.Haqqani's argument is; Beggars dont argue. And he seems to be very confident about his role as a beggar.

Kashif Abbasi is a misguided clown but Haqqani is definitely competing for the honors.

Brilliant! Made him look like a fool.

Saira,



Please explain to me in specific terms what you would call a "severe diplomatic message"? What will you tell the Americans? I've seen Haqqani talk to Americans and he has made Senators look like fools for arguing for invasion on Pakistan.

Well kudos to him if he has done that. He should be commended for doing his job well if what you are saying is true. But what he should not do is to appear like an appeaser on a program targeted towards Pakistani audiences. A Pakistani diplomat arguing so passionately about how inferior we are to the US hardly makes any sense. He should have talked about what the Pakistani government has done, i.e they issued a stern statement about how they viewed this act as "cowardly".

A stern diplomatic stance could be along the lines of what GOP has already done, i.e issuance of a statement which says," This act is viewed as cowardly and attacks like this could jeopardize the continued cooperation of Pakistan on the War on Terror." Everyone with an iota of sense knowns that certain statements coming out of the FO are for domestic consumption only. The Americans would have also understood this but the point is apparently loss on Mr.Haqqani who seems to be more upset on how the news media is handling the issue then the actual loss of Pakistani life.

Saira,

Ambassadors are meant to make statements to the countries they are sent to, not for home consumption. The problem is if we keep making "stern statements" when everyone knows that no action will be followed, then we have zero credibility. Haqqani had a press conference today where he asked US govt to be patient while Pakistan tries talks. Haqqani is upset because we have a democratic govt now and when fools like Kashif or Hamid Mir provoke our public to be jazbaati then it puts elected leaders in awkward position. No one is saying agree to US totally but just be careful what you say and how you say it.

BTW, the interview was taken before the border post attack.

WOT will be won based on efforts on Afghanistan and Pakistan.

Pakistan probably has done more in WOT than any other country in this fight, with # of troops deployed, casualties, etc. I would put Pakistani efforts in WOT to be close to 90-80%, where 10-20% room would be further improvement.

I think Haqqani brilliantly highlighted 10-20% improvement needed from Pakistan in efforts pertaining to WOT.

WOT in Afghanistan where WOT is really being fought is unfortunately not even close to a success (more like 70% failure). Afghan government failure is being disguised by blaming Pakistan.

- Narcotics trade is at all time high which probably supporting insurgency.
- Afghan army is not capable to guard Afghan border let alone lawless country side.
- NATO doesnt have enough troops as acknowledged by western sources.

And after watching this episode with Live with Talat with Afghan Ambassador, I dont think Afghan government will get serious about fighting WOT. Ambassador avoided all key questions posed by Talat.

http://affairspk.com/2008/06/20/live-with-...t-20-june-2008/

Kashif Abbasi behaves like a fresh graduate of some college or university with a very good hold on current affairs but at the same time no knowledge or common sense of the international political affairs. I would say that anyone with some good references can becoeme an anchor person of any program. He is arguing with a person who has real life professional experiance equal to that of Kashif Abbasi. He really needs to grow up.

This interview was not going to be aired on CNN or was it ? His statements in this program were targeted at a Pakistani audience and not an American one.



And the alternative is no statements and no actions is better ? Its diplomatic norm that the FO issues statments which are targeted towards the domestic audience. The GOP actually did this its just that Mr.Haqqani does a very poor job defending it.



He has pretty thin skin for the job he is doing if he gets upset by what some media person says. Media personal work like this all over the world with varying degrees of spin and propaganda. They appeal to people's passions and not to their logic in the US as well, look at my earlier post for examples.



I did hear something about 4 attacks during the interview but I might be mistaken.

Kashif Abbasi is not wrong, but un-experienced to handle the crook and bayghairat haqqani.

Please tell which one of the points made by Haqqani are wrong. Be specific and show evidence. Too often jazbati types use name calling because they have nothing else to say.

There was a "what if" thread on pakistan not participating in war on terror. And i said well now we are attacked when they want and we say it was us, and in other case we would be attacked and we will say they did. (attacks on school and villages that our general saab thought we committed).

and then there was another one liner by me stating that it will be great if we can use what we have. (pointing our inability to engage the high altitude targets but capable of hitting lower altitude objects)

The interview brings one liner response from me in a little more packing. I have stated many times that a beggar has no freewill but the one that is imposed by "generous" giver.

I have not heard the whole interview but what it sounds like, the guy just gave the poison of truth.

Ok not a single thing he said was wrong, after seeing the whole thing.

thanks for asking.
Pakistan was forced into "war on terrorism" and Musharraf has openly admitted this. (remeber stone age threat)
war on terrorism is not our own war. it has screwed our security, unity, economy, and national esteem.
starting to enjoy an inevitable rape makes sense. but calling it a need is wrong.
Haqqani is building everything else on this wrong assumption.
If he represents openion of Pakistani public, he shouldn't say this.

I don't agree
He is good at debate but he is misusing the skill.

Ok, let me ask you something. Can you answer his one simple question " what are you going to do?". The reality bites but what he is saying is the truth that the situation that we are in doesnt leave any other choice but to follow the dictation given by US.

Again you might not like it but when it comes down to it, you cant do nothing but to complain and our GOV is doing it. but if you are thinking of something else then please go ahead answer US in the way you want when he strikes with UAV and says "putt lo jo puttnra jay".

simple answer is to change the current official Afghan policy.
gov't has people who get payed on public money, meant to invent and design nuts and bolts of policies.

here are simple things........for your what iff.
some ideas may make you laugh at this time but......laugh is all based on mental relativity.

1. NATO forces need to apologise and pay damage for pakistani nationals / troops killed by them on Pakistan's soil.
2. Make clear that there will be no military/ human/logistic/food transit service from Pakistan in case of any such future violation.
3. Ask US to lay off India from Baluchistan border if he wants our assistance in WOT. hand over any Baluch separatist otherwise we reserve the right of non cooperation. ISI sould be given access to bodering provinces for Anti pakistan issues.
4. Ask for reasonable Defence equipment for our defence needs free of cost. what the heck is 2 F-16s and 1.5 helicopter and .75 transporter peanuts.
we need enough to be at balance with India.
make it roughly 200 aircrafts + ~30 naval ships/subs + SAM missiles (That defence minister was weeping about)


If these demands are tossed away....as they are most likely due to our spineless leaders.

it proves that Pakistan is being abused in name of war on terror.
we need to quit being a party and need to remain at most neutral.
fence the Durand line at possible infiltration routes.
Govt should Appologize Tribal people for leaving them alone against USA in past. pay handsome damages and in exchange broker a deal to not get involved in any anti Pakistan terrorism. that makes its "our own problem" for our pseudo-intellectuals.

bill USA for US rate of 1000s of dead soldiers, deployment of 100 K troops for last 7 years on Pak-afgan border. also ask for the price of airbases and facilities used in pakistan. instead of US reminding us about the "US aid" he gave us for all this, he should pay the rest of bill.
hire Economists for this math, not a Financial Banker.


as a rough estimate, 100000x40000x7 = 28 billion dollars
evaluat the worth of facilities and support and it will top 50B easily.


how stupid, you do this for some 5 billion dollars plus 50 billion kicks.

while calling it "our own war" we are giving US a free lunch from our own pocket.

publish the balance sheet, and as most likely expected, it won't be payed, deduct it from loans with USA. and ask him to keep the change. as NATO includes most of our creditors, we can get rid of most of our loans too.

all this should be just to remain neutral in the fake WOT.

I like the U.S. Rate idea in making a charge sheet...given Pakistan's contributions, I think it should be compensated on fair grounds.

A man once goes to a well dressed woman and says - "Will you have sex with me for $1,000?" She slaps him. Then he says, "How about $1 million?" She starts thinking. He then says, "Now that we have established you are a whore, let's negotiate."

We need to think strategically. Pakistan is in no position to negotiate. Even if the US says, we'll give you $1 trillion. Will you agree to give up nukes? Once you ask $$ for services, can you ever say no to anything?

"paisay day kar marwana" is worst than prostitution. and we are stuck in this situation.

similarly if we simply increase the price tag of cooperation to a realistic level, even half of real Economical and strategic cost of services at "In US" price, they will either run away, or we will not remain beggars.

either way, govt. just needs to stop this bulshit of "we r fighting our own war"....

Look, you don't have to fight a war to win. You fight for what is right. I think if we went to an all out war, we would cause the USA significant damage whilst they would entirely wipe us out. I'm willing to do that for dignity IF NEEDS BE, the Pakistani people are, our leaders aren't. Nobody argues we can win an all out war, we can win other limited conflicts, we can be decimated in other limited conflicts. What we lack is leadership who is willing to sacrifice for the nation, or sacrifce the nation for honour.

We can take a tougher stance against the USA. We can threaten to cut all support for them in the war on terror and fight our internal war ourselves. Assume we did that, and they ignored us, we can ACT upon our threat. what will they do?

- sanction us? Yeah we'd live a harder life, economics would be harder, developement would slow down, poverty would increase, but in the long term we could become more independent, our industries less reliant on the west and we would have our soverignity and our self respect.

What else could they do? Attack us? They could start with airstrikes, right now we sit back, but we could attack back we could take down thie aircraft. At that point they might back off, they did against the iranians during the 80's... or they could intensiy thier attacks and attack our installations. We could launch missile attacks on US installations in Afghanistan, Deigo Garcia, Iraq, Arab peninsula, carrier groups in the Indian ocean and Arabian sea. We could if we tried hard enough destroy thier forward attacking bases.

What will happen then? They will send in long distance bombers, they will attack with cruise missiles, we could engage them, but we will take more damage than them. At some point the USA will have to land troops on our soil. We have a land mass the size of western europe, we have 160 million people and a 900,000 man army. it could take them 6 months to a year to prepare the support force to back up the landing force if we took out thier regional bases, assuming they did, they invade, we can destroy thier forces within our cities and our mountains, like Grozny.

The only way they can win is if they keep attacking from the air, take out the PAF and then bomb us to bits, but as long as we resist, they cannot have total victory. They can only have that if they nuke us, andif they do that we cna nuke India and Israel and wipe out them as we are wiped out.

All this is entirely possible, but it would mean being willing to face total destruction and be willing to escalate conflicts. We have to ask ourselves, how far is the USA willing to go in conflict against us? How far would they push us? right now, they might as well invade, we'll just clam they got lost on the way to kabul.

I'm not advocating all out war or getting annhilated, i'm saying you have to be ready for it and willing to do it, to survive. That is also why i am always barking about ICBM's, because if we had the ability to launch nuclear wepaons at the US homeland as a final resort, they will know we can finish them too, rather than we are willing to damage them and be finished off rather than become whores to them.

Unfortunately we have leaders who don't have the spine to face apocolyse. The iranians are willing to face it, hence they stay away from them.

I'v watched 2nd episode of Kashif Abbasi's interview with Hussain Haqqani.
either Kashif is over impressed of location, or he a piplia and is doing noora kushti with Hussain.

anyway everybody knows, every flattering theory of Haqqani blew up within few days of this recording.
Pakistan is right weher it was in september 2001.

we have been working on shamefully low wage, and now NRO party wishes to continue on our own expenses, calling it "our own war".

Mojaaan ee Mojaan.

All Mr. Haqqani is saying that no need for any terms of engagement let US do what ever she wants to do. This is the only blunder Mushraaf made in 2001 when he joined WOT. Look at Lybia and Egypt how they got Money and weapons from US for being ally... Musharaaf chose fearful policy by not asking for any prior demands, even now everybody is asking "What if"... I just want answer of my simple question...

"What if Pakistan cut supplies to NATO through its border"?- Don't come and tell me that US will attack Pakistan coz for an attack to be affected one need certain number of troops and fuel... Currently NATO lack both in Afghanistan. It is US/NATO depending on Pakistan not vice versa.

In facct, ruling class of Pakistan makes money by keeping public afraid for US invasion, and keeping west afraid of talibanization of Pakistan at a single time.
they have successfully milked both parties for quiet a long time.

I agree with Saira, Schmuck and Shaheen. I fail to see how Haqqani bit*h slapped Kashif. Kashif has done a poor job but most of his questions are correct. Huqqani on the other side seems quite convinced that we cannot do anything to protect our sovereignty and borders. Instead of protesting against this he was providing arguments on why we cant protest against the actions. It was shameful and I felt disgusted.
Yes we have extremist organisations in our country but its our job to fight them we dont need anyone else crossing our borders to do that. Haqqani just kept asking Kashif on what he thinks we should do. well its not Kashif's job. Kashif's job is to raise these issues on media which he is doing (even if he is doing a cr@p job). Huqqani and his likes are paid to find solutions to exactly such issues and he seems incapable of doing that. He is more worried about the job press is doing. If this is what we are reduced to then its shameful.

Haqqani completely destroyed Kashif Abbasi and his emotional and silly questions. Haqqani's point is correct that Pakistan does not have the strength to do "kushti" with NATO/US, and anyone who wants to is welcome to suggest how exactly Pakistan can do. Kashif Abbasi was unable to say how.

I hope that you personally come and fight with a gun in your hand rather than giving instructions from your A/c room



Correct me if I am wrong, last time they sanctioned us we went bankrupt. How does a bankrupt become independent. How do you propose to clear the huge deficit and the loans that we have taken.



So basically you want to destroy India and Israel after being nuked by the yanks. Please tell me our second strike capability. And how many cities will you destroy, before we are wiped out from the map of the world. Please, dont be jazbaati like Kashif Abbasi Plati, let me give my frank opinion, if US nukes us; nobody will say anything because it will be a war against terror. But the moment we push the nuke button the entire world will nuke us back and the muslim ummah for being incapable of handling nukes. Yaar, might is right. And as Haqqani said we dont have the might so, "hame haamra haath hoola rakhna parega"




This proves that you will never come to Pakistan to fight, neither will I, so let the Pakistanis decide what they want to do. We have no right to speak in its internal matter all we can do is be an observer. I think people like Dizasta and other who are in Pakistan are the people who should be speaking about this.

Again no offense intended....
Peace Out

Why don't we go to Parliament?

I'm scratching my head, it's such a simple idea.

Why the hell do we not go to Parliament, hold a vote to see whether the people's representatives believe in this WoT being fought on the US' terms?

The question is: which side would they vote for?

Didn't NS use the same tactic to relieve pressure off himself in 1998? "Parlaiment sanctions these nukes... the people of Pakistan want it... bugger off The World..."

I mean what could anyone do? This is demcracy at its best; surely our esteemed allies the US and NATO could not go against the wishes of the people of Pakistan? What would they do? Declare war on us? And world pressure wouldn't be over-whelmingly in our favour?

Here's the crunch guys: a confrontation is looming. This is inevitable. Either we throw off the shackles of US dominantion now, or it happens through a bloody revolution.

another america-fighter sitting abroad!

not pointing my finger at anyone, as I'm myself comfortably sitting in the West... but all those who want a confrontaton should first move to Pakistan and then talk about confrontation.

Exactly. I call these guys cyberjihadis or burger-jihadis. Some are not even citizens of Pakistan, while others are enjoying life in Western countries. Yet they want Pakistanis to take up unwinnable fights for the sake of izzat or gheirat etc.

Pehlay Pakistan par tashrif laiyay aur phir jihad kee baat keejiyay.

Pakistan got lucky once after supporting the Talibans. Nobody will give us another chance if we make the same mistake again.

You know what f**k you man. Who the f**k are you to judge me? Come to my face and repeat that sh1t and you'll see what i will and will not do.

It's purely coz of pussies like you we are in the problems we are in. Your scared of being wiped out.

I swear in the name of Allah i don't give a sh1t about dying as i intend to live my life in a dignified and honourable manner or not live it at all.

I swear in the name of Allah if a day comes in which we go to war and the final breathes of our nation are about to be drawn, i will be there to draw my final breaths alongside it.

Inshallah.

You people p1ss me off with your chicken sh1t attitudes.

Furthermore I'd like to add if day was to come where Britain was invaded and my home was threatened, I wish Allah grants me shahadat protecting my home and my family in Britain.

You don't have to be brandishing a klashinikov sat in a cave to be brave, that's all i ask of you, to be brave! If not for your own sake for the sake of the sons one day Inshallah you will all raise.

Fighting and dying for the sake of a band of bearded cavemen who stand for everything we stand against - is not bravery. It is stupidity and suicidal tendency.

I'll fight for my family, my wife and my child. I'll NOT fight for barbaric stone age animals.

wrong, you can't even die for your family, wife or child.
people with your mindset just offer them to any robber in order to save own life, with some slogan like, "sab say pehlay meri jaan"

Who the ###### are you to tell me what I'll do to protect my family?

How about this. People of your mindset will encourage others to pick up fights while running away when you are called.

well you are forgetting something. we have have mush, ganja, zardari for policy making. You are talking like there is Gen. zia negotiating.

watch Haqqani's interview again, and then answer this question:


what exactly will you do ?

right now i can do nothing, give me charge of the country and watch exactly what i would do.

also please refrain from insulting each other.... i apologise to zionist about my earlier outbusrt, my point still stands.

Here is kind of my ideal game plan;

1. Ring President Bush and tell him in frank terms, that we will not accept US tyranny. Tell him if support is wanted in the WoT it will be on our terms as it's our region and our nation in the firing line, not theirs. Tell him if they want to do it any other way it will be without us and if they cross us, we will go down taking them out.

2. Deploy our armed forces on the western border. Mine the border and do joint patrols with the locals. We need to secure that border to ensure nothing comes into Pakistan.

3. Move military hardware closer to the border, such as SAM's and artillery and have some airbases on high alert. If we have activity that is unwelcome we want to be able to take action. As a part of this we may want to spend some money getting the best SAM's china can offer us straight away. They will be deployed just in that location to provide a credible threat.

4. We must fight our own war against people who are fighting us. We must stop them and disarm them and take out their leaders at any cost. We cannot accept Taliban in Pakistan. This must be a fully fledged effort. The only people we are willing to deal with are those who are willing to work under us and aer willing to only have influence in Afghanistan. The only role we want us helping them setup FOB in Afghanistan, so that we can be completely rid of them. Obviously that must be done covertly.

5. If the US was to attack our territory in an accident, we take down thier planes and attack back with equal force, we then ensure that the nearest forward operating base is bombed properly so they know not to attack us.

At that point i don't expect them to attack back, if they do, then we do what we can.

I hope platinum's reply is sufficient for you but if not then I will repeat some of the things

Condemn all invasions in strongest possible way. I am not sure if a person like haqqani with the mind set he has got can do this job. He has already accepted defeat. I also dont expect his argument on why we cant protest in UN. Yes every country has a right to attack terrorism but that right does not give you authority to invade sovereign countries. Its Pakistan's right to fight terror within its border. They can always help us with intelligence and equipment but the decision to take action is ours. May be we can give them permission to hit the target but as long as its agreed.
I am not sure if you remember this but when Kashmir was hit by quake two US choppers on aid mission wandered into indian airspace. Did you hear the response from indian side?
Similarly do you remember when british navy wandered into iranian water. What treatment they got and then here we are too scared to protect our life and economy.
Another example is US pushing india on dropping the pipe line deal with Iran and Pak. Have you by any chance heard what they said in response. All countries with any dignity and self respect would look after their interests before anything else.
Do you think we are even worse than our neighbours in standing for our rights.

I am not in favour of war or confrontation with the west. I think that we can maintain a balance between the two. we should support WOT as its in our benefit as well but at the same time we need to protect our dignity and sovereignty. People like Mr Huqqani are paid by the tax payers to do that. If he thinks that he cannot do it and is relying on TV presenters to tell him what to do when our country is invaded then he needs to get his act straight. We dont need defeatist who give excuses on why they could do nothing we need people who can stand up for our values and dignity.
Lets not look at extremes i.e. either we roll over and let them do what the want cause we cannot do anything OR go for an all out confrontation. There is always a middle path and that what called diplomacy. If our diplomats dont know what diplomacy means that God have mercy on us.

What if US bombs a city next, will we still act like a bunch of cowards? my question is where do we draw a line in the sand. The thing is after getting bombed we didn't even put out a strong deplomatic protest, I mean how low are we planning to go?

Who says anything about fighting them?

I'm saying, go to Parliament. If Parliament says we want out, then it significantly lessens the burden on any one individual telling America to go away.

If the need arises, what are our armed forces for? Why do we pay them $Billions every year?

I don't even feel stupid saying this from the comfort of my armchair in the UK. The fact is, the Pakistani Military isn't paid to sit in bunkers. It's paid to defend Pakistan, and our soverignty. Call me whatever you want, call me a Brit, or a traitor, or an armchair general. I really couldn't care less. But don't deny that fact. Let's hold on to our soverignty, because if we don't have that, we don't have anything.

We lost sovereignty the day we allowed Arabs, Chechens, Uzbeks and others to set up base in FATA. Nobody complained then.

We lost sovereignty the day 200 soldiers surrendered to 20 terrrorists. Nobody complained then.

We lost sovereignty the day historic forts were overrun by gangs of Talibans. Nobody complained then.

We lost sovereignty the day killers of Benazir conducted open press conferences. Nobody complained then.

We lost sovereignty the day terrorists caught and beheaded jawans just for being in Pakistan army. Nobody complained then.

Get real man. FATA has long ceased to be sovereign Pakistan territory. Our own army is afraid to go there.

What sovereignty?

The same people suggested the same thing back then and have at each stage faced the same hurdle of people being afraid of waging war.

I am all for our troops taking on and wiping out the Taliban. We can and should take them out. That is a valid fight.

I'm not for taking unnecessary panga with the Americans, especially on behalf of the people who behead our troops and bomb girls schools.

Pangay na lein tu maar kyoon paRheygi?

why dont you get the same sort of anger when militants bomb Pakistanis every day ?

If you think that we dont feel the same anger then you are mistaken. I dont why you are equating protest against the US attack by support for extremist elements.

* We dont not like the terrorists breeding on our land.
* We do not condone their attacks on innocent people whether Pakistani or from any other nation.
* We do not support their attacks on our military and paramilitary forces.
* We do not want them to tarnish the image of our country or religion.
* We want them gone as much as any peace loving individual will do.

What you are proposing is that this can only be achieved by letting US or Afghan troops do what ever they feel like in our territory even if that involves killing innocent people and soldiers of our army.
You are saying that they should be allowed to cross the border without any regard for our sovereignty.
You are saying that we should just close our eyes and tolerate that because "We cannot do anything about it"

Who says we cannot do anything. Like some one else said in another post what do we maintain a strong army. The sole purpose of this Army is to defend the nation from both external and internal enemies. This means that on one hand we need to deal with the elements within our borders and on other side we need to make sure that nobody takes us a coward nation that has no capability to defend its border or self-respect.

Also its easier for any one from outside to come and bomb the terrorists but then they are not around to deal with the consequences. Not all issues are handled by force. we need to maintain a balance between how we handle the extremist elements. This will involve negotiations, providing opportunities and incentives and isolating the normal people who are forced into this system from the hardcore elements. At the same time force can be used against the hard core groups without offending the rest of the population.

The current approach is only creating more resistance specially when the people targeted believe that our forces have joined hands with the people who are bombing them in the first place.

How do you think these people (specially the innocent ones) will react when US missile kill their families and destroy their houses. Who do you think a common man in such situation will blame.

It was not long ago when our president MR. Musharraf never got tired of explaining to the world that we need to look at the root causes of terror if we need to eliminate it. It seems that the Musharraf who understood the real problems has long left the scene.

Like I said above Pakistan has done more in this fight than any other country. I think Pakistan has done a superb job, whereas Afghanistan side has been a disaster.

This mantra, that WOT is being lost primarily because of Pakistan border crossing, is BS. The reason this mantra is quickly becoming fact is that Pakistan leaders have already accepted it as a fact rather than talking about real failures in Afghanistan.

Fact is Afghanistan side WOT is a horrible failure (70% failure IMO maybe more). If anyone here sincerely wants to win WOT, then its time to address real failures rather than address Pakistan (10% failure which Haqqani highlighted brilliantly).

- Narcotics substance are not being grown and produced in FATA but in Afghanistan. Guess where the money is going?
http://news.bbc.co.uk/2/hi/south_asia/7469194.stm

- In above interview Afghan ambassador doesnt even know how many Afghan forces are deployed to border to catch terrorist. Afghan army needs to get in shape not run away like they did in parade.

- Much hoop-la is made about FATA crossing into Afghan side, but rarely anyone talks about infiltration from Afghan side into Pakistan to destabilize and terrorize with help of neighboring 3rd country.

- NATO Generals are asking for more troops. NATO doesnt have enough troops to secure lawlessness in Afghanistan. Even with additional 6000 its less.
http://afp.google.com/article/ALeqM5h0wnuv...Rrw04cvHCSH70dg

If Mr. Haqqani is sincere about WOT then he should focus on real major failures rather than talk about Pakistan little failures. Dropping ones shalwar and bending down in front of others doesnt lead to dignified results.

Pakistan can put in 110% but if Afghan side is continue going to post 70% failures and then blame Pakistan, it will be a disaster for WOT.

That what I am exactly saying and please no swearing because even I can use all the F* words and if you want to have a competition then we can open a new thread. But, I am not raised that way to use inappropriate language. All wanted say is preach what you practice. I rest my case.

No Offence taken....

Peace Out