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Shehz
We seem to specialize in firing competent people once out of the country http://dawn.com/2008/07/24/top3.htm

July 24, 2008 Thursday Rajab 20, 1429

FBR chief sacked on way to Russia for customs talks

By Mubarak Zeb Khan

ISLAMABAD, July 23: The government sacked Federal Board of Revenue chairman M. Abdullah Yousuf on Wednesday and appointed Board of Investment Secretary Ahmed Waqar to succeed him.

Mr Yousuf, who was one of the important economic managers of the previous government, was removed from the post in an unceremonious way. He is in Geneva as member of an official delegation to the WTO ministerial meeting and was scheduled to leave for Moscow on Wednesday for talks with Russian officials on customs cooperation.

On Tuesday, he was made member of a committee to recommend ways for reducing the impact of international oil prices on economy.

According to a notification issued by the establishment division, the services of Mr Yousuf as chairman of the FBR and secretary general revenue were terminated with immediate effect.

Ahmad Waqar, a BS-22 officer of the secretariat group, has been given the additional charge of the revenue division. He will take over his new assignment on Thursday.

Mr Waqar was removed from the post of finance secretary by the caretaker government on charges of alleged inefficiency.

Mr Yousuf, who held additional charge of secretary general revenue, was among the four trusted economic managers of President Pervez Musharraf. All of them have been eased out. The other three are Export Promotion Bureau chairman Tariq Ikram, deputy chairman of the Planning Commission Dr Akram Shaikh and finance secretary Dr Waqar Masood.

Just three days before the completion of its five-year term in November last year, the PML-Q-led government had granted a three-year extension to Mr Yousuf, who turned 60 in March of this year. The extension was granted to ensure continuity of the World Bank-funded reforms project for tax administration which was expected to be completed next year.

An accountant by profession, Mr Yousuf also served as director finance and managing director of the Utility Stores Corporation and secretary of the Board of Investment, ministry of industry and the Privatisation Commission. He worked as secretary of the ministry of petroleum and natural resources for five years.

He was inducted into the unified regular cadre of the secretariat group in BPS-22 in 2006 and was subsequently declared the senior-most federal secretary, followed by his elevation to the post of secretary general.

When Mr Yousuf took charge of the FBR in 2004, the revenue collection was Rs518.8 billion, which increased to over Rs1,002 billion in 2007-08.
smegster
QUOTE(Shehz @ Jul 24 2008, 12:21 PM) *


So someone who was able to double revenue within four years is being replaced by someone who was sacked for inefficiencies

This government stoops lower and lower.

Is everyone enjoying democracy?
Mangla
QUOTE(Shehz @ Jul 24 2008, 12:21 PM) *
So someone who was able to double revenue within four years is being replaced by someone who was sacked for inefficiencies

This government stoops lower and lower.

Is everyone enjoying democracy?


Democracy is just a cover for corruption. Pakistanis can only vote for corruption, no alternative PML N or PPP. PML N will win in next election, then after that PPP will win. Vicious circle.
Shehz
Abdullah Yusuf is actually a finance minister material person.
Unlike Darr and co., he would come up with far-sighted problems, and suggested alternates or solutions to counter them.

Running a government is a team work, every department has their specialists.
Our democrats assume they are the jack of all trades, and be the wanna do it all.
Every speech, without fail, will be that happenned, and this is the problem, and we have no solutions.
Ghias
Abdullah Yousuf is the same guy who goes thumak thumak in this youtube video.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=xU9Damy4cEk

Good riddance. Now he can return to his actual profession.
MoThSmOkE
Sacked on his way to Russia?

This government stoops lower and lower. Democracy anyone?

PakistanFlag.gif
instantexcess
QUOTE(Ghias @ Jul 24 2008, 11:58 PM) *
Abdullah Yousuf is the same guy who goes thumak thumak in this youtube video.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=xU9Damy4cEk

Good riddance. Now he can return to his actual profession.



you realize that you are judging his professional skills as a financial manager based on his 'thumak thumak' ...


Blind fools are doomed to fail.

Inshallah Zardari and Nawaz will make you ubber happy.

-----------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------



Btw, did anyone notice the way he was sacked? While on an International tour?

Seriously ... will someone hang these clowns already? Seems like they are running their local plantation and not a country.


PPP + PML-N = Donkey Force
Ghias
QUOTE(instantexcess @ Jul 25 2008, 01:08 PM) *
you realize that you are judging his professional skills as a financial manager based on his 'thumak thumak' ...


Blind fools are doomed to fail.

Inshallah Zardari and Nawaz will make you ubber happy.

Dude I don't support Nawaza or Ghaddari. Just check my signature or read my previous posts. All I'm trying to say is that there is no excuse for what he did. Come one, there's something called official decorum and everyone has to follow it. You can't just start dancing like he did.Dont give me the crap about it being a show or whatever. He was there in his official capacity and he should have maintained the decorum. If you're not aware of this then please don't talk about it. Official decorum in government organizations has to be rigidly maintained. The guy totally lost it that day just to show himself as an enlighted Muslim in front of Mushy. He was being a chamcha and he crossed all known limits of chmchaism on that day. Just sacking this guy is not going to cripple Pakistan. Organizations are not run by individuals otherwise KRL would been closed by now. No one is absolutely necessary. Maybe he was doing a good job in the office but that doesn't mean he's irreplaceable. Now I don't trust Ghadari and Nawaza gov. to revolutionize the org. etc etc. But this guy deserved to be sacked for his totally unprofessional behavior and breaking of official decorum and for gaining the title of the chamcha of the century.
Shehz
QUOTE(Ghias @ Jul 25 2008, 04:33 AM) *
He was there in his official capacity and he should have maintained the decorum. If you're not aware of this then please don't talk about it. Official decorum in government organizations has to be rigidly maintained. The guy totally lost it that day just to show himself as an enlighted Muslim in front of Mushy. He was being a chamcha and he crossed all known limits of chmchaism on that day.


And you're judging the guy based solely on your perception.
In family weddings, there is dancing in mehendi's, there are "business guests" there too, no one assumes or compares their own family members to the dancing girls in the market.

The constituition of Pakistan doesn't prohibit him from dancing, then why are you being judgemental?
He was there after hours, no government offices was in session or business was being conducted, and they were there with their own family members.

Decorum is limited to within 'office' policy and on official visits, no one was brainstorming finance deals on that function.
However, I do agree that he shouldn't have danced that way either, but that in no way undermines his capability.
At-least the new guy should have been more qualified than him, that too unjustifies the move.

Last, but not the least, this was again "on his way to Russia" haphazard move, that can cause legal problems later, like suo moto, or law suit by next government.
He has to be given 2 week notice (or whatever the norm is), as he's not an elected rep., but an employee of the govt. of Pakistan.
This step alone proves the current set up and the democrats are just not competent enough to serve Pakistan at all.

Nepotism is filling in empty seats with favorites. This move, without giving him any cause for the action, is itself an illegal move under the constituition of Pakistan (Ministry of Labour).
must7
Dude I don't support Nawaza or Ghaddari. Just check my signature or read my previous posts. All I'm trying to say is that there is no excuse for what he did. Come one, there's something called official decorum and everyone has to follow it. You can't just start dancing like he did

You are quite correct on this point .. however, we don't have a lot of internationally recognized financial economists .. hence, we have to give exceptions .. If that was not enough .. any govt. official who is going on organized foreign visits should not be sacked ... as what sort of a message will the host party be getting of Pakistani governace !
Ghias
QUOTE(Shehz @ Jul 25 2008, 09:36 PM) *
And you're judging the guy based solely on your perception.
In family weddings, there is dancing in mehendi's, there are "business guests" there too, no one assumes or compares their own family members to the dancing girls in the market.

The constituition of Pakistan doesn't prohibit him from dancing, then why are you being judgemental?
He was there after hours, no government offices was in session or business was being conducted, and they were there with their own family members.

Decorum is limited to within 'office' policy and on official visits, no one was brainstorming finance deals on that function.


Mehnid's and shadi's are a totally personal affair. This was not his daughter's shadi or something. He wont be in a family mehndi as "Chairman FBR", he'll be there as father or whatever he is of the bride or groom. He can do whatever he want to do in there and I won't complain.But he was there as "Chairman FBR", not just some relative or something. It was an official gathering. It sure was not a private party. Mushy was there as President of Pakistan and not Pervaiz the golfer, Shaukat Aziz was there as Prime Minister of Pakistan, not as the lovely friend Shauki!. Everything was official so official decorum applies.

QUOTE
However, I do agree that he shouldn't have danced that way either, but that in no way undermines his capability.


Agreed, but it does prove him as a chamcha of the highest calibre. These are the kind of people who are called "Shah say ziada shah kay wafadaar".

QUOTE
At-least the new guy should have been more qualified than him, that too unjustifies the move.


Again, I'm not supporting the move because PPP did it and I'm not saying that the new guy is not there by favourtism but he's not straight out of Larkana or any other Sindhi goth either. I not for one second believe that he's brought in for his qualifications and experience but just dismissing the guy by saying that he's not as qualified is a bit unfair. See:

".....Ahmad Viqar has 37-year experience in the field of economics and finance and currently he is serving Board of Investment (BoI) as its secretary. He did his MBA with distinction. He served as member finance of the Capital Development Authority (CDA) and brought a turnaround in fiscal affairs of the authority......"


http://thenews.jang.com.pk/top_story_detail.asp?Id=16167

Maybe Abdullah Yousuf was sacked for the wrong reasons but he had it coming for one reason or another. I bet even if Mush was still in power he would have been sacked by now. He started a count down timer that day for himself. Do you have any idea what kind of a joke he had become in his own organization?

QUOTE
Last, but not the least, this was again "on his way to Russia" haphazard move, that can cause legal problems later, like suo moto, or law suit by next government.
He has to be given 2 week notice (or whatever the norm is), as he's not an elected rep., but an employee of the govt. of Pakistan.


Thats just a speculation. It depends on what was written in his offer letter for the job. Normally it is 30 or 15 days notice for relatively junior contract employees but for senior employees like him a 24 hours notice is not uncommon in Pakistan.

QUOTE
This move, without giving him any cause for the action, is itself an illegal move under the constituition of Pakistan (Ministry of Labour).


There is a huge difference between contract and permanent employees in Pakistan. Permanent guys are very hard to kick out and normally when higher ups are really pissed off with them they just transfer them or make them OSD or give them warning or a show cause notice but actually kicking out a permanent government employee is nearly impossible without very solid reasons. People normally head for courts when higher ups try sack them so it is usually avoided as the matter becomes complicated and courts get involved. Employees get stay orders and all sh*t hits the fan. It became a bit easy after Mushy introduced Ordinance 2000 but its still very tough.

But its exactly opposite for contract employees. Normally in Pakistan their contracts say that they can be sacked without any reason given and cannot complain and cannot go to any court. When they are sacked they stay sacked and there ain't nothing they can do about it and it is absolutely in accordance with the constitution and law of Pakistan. It gives every employer the right to offer the jobs on its term and both parties that are the employer and the employee agree on it before starting. Abdullah Yousuf retired a few years ago and was on extension now i.e. contract.

QUOTE
This step alone proves the current set up and the democrats are just not competent enough to serve Pakistan at all. the democrats are just not competent enough to serve Pakistan at all.


This step? only this step? For me every step this government has taken so far proves this, and I don't expect any improvement either. Its a typical PPP government who'll loot Pakistan till there's nothing left to loot and then run away to Dubai and UK for liberation of democracy, freedom of suppressed people etc. etc.

But this particular guy just had it coming for one reason or another.

QUOTE(must7 @ Jul 26 2008, 12:10 PM) *
Dude I don't support Nawaza or Ghaddari. Just check my signature or read my previous posts. All I'm trying to say is that there is no excuse for what he did. Come one, there's something called official decorum and everyone has to follow it. You can't just start dancing like he did

You are quite correct on this point .. however, we don't have a lot of internationally recognized financial economists .. hence, we have to give exceptions .. If that was not enough .. any govt. official who is going on organized foreign visits should not be sacked ... as what sort of a message will the host party be getting of Pakistani governace !


Nobody is a sacred cow after AQK episode in Pakistan and I don't think we have such acute shortage of financial experts that without this one guy FBR will collapse.

But I do agree with you on the second point i.e he should not have been sacked while on an official tour to foreign countries. It will add another dhabba on Pakistan's face aboard, but what else can you expect from thugs of PPP. People voted them into power and are now reaping its benefits.
Mangla
Yep if the dicision to fire him was based on the youtube video. I agree with the order. wacko.gif

They should have all got fired and trampled to death by a horse. tongue4.gif

At the UN
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=SsLFGGO6_f0...feature=related

Various dancing politicians

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=9WqQL5WFN20
mdbao
nice...so now it okay for competent people to get fired for dancing yet all looters and murderers can freely rule and abuse Pakistan and its people. talk about priorities.
Salim
QUOTE(Ghias @ Jul 25 2008, 06:58 AM) *
Abdullah Yousuf is the same guy who goes thumak thumak in this youtube video.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=xU9Damy4cEk

Good riddance. Now he can return to his actual profession.

Please, Come on ... do not stoop so low to go below the belt. What Abdullah Yousuf was doing in function is nothing to do with his professional job neither his enjoying himself should be cause for concern. Actually, it is these people who can enjoy their time when relaxed give most output when working. Else, we have many Retards in Pakistan who look for enjoyment of 70 Virgins after death by committing suicide and killing innocent others along with themselves. Well, we also have crooks in Pakistan who enjoy their life at the expense of Nation. For instance, Nawaz who go for hair transplant so that to grow hair on his ganja head from stolen money of Pakistani poor, and Zardari who feeds his horses Apple Jam from stolen money of Pakistani poor. These days, mentioned two pathetic crooks (NS and AAZ) are enjoying their life at the expense of Pakistani poor, by doing world tour and making decision for Pakistan from various hotels of foreign countries ... paid by Pakistan, even when these two are not even part of Parliament.

As for personal life, youtube, and morality, then we have present Prime Minister ‘Yousuf Raza Gillani’ who deserves getting sacked most, as we can see him playing with tits of his co-political leader ‘Sherry Rahman’. We also see Pakistani future King Bilawal whose picture is all around drunk and fallen on the shoulders of his girlfriend. We even have movies of BB swimming and sitting in swimming costume in public and Imran ex-girlfriend Sita White asking Imran to fulfil his paternal duty towards his illegitimate daughter. Well, if one start paparazzi career in Pakistan then we would find that most of our top politicians, beard and non-beard, are all morally flat. As for Abdullah Yousuf, what he was doing was just passing time gesture and nothing else.

As for his performance in job, we have to ask, what is the job of chairman FBR?

To me, his job is to work hard and make sure federal revenue of Pakistan increases so that it can be used to develop the country. It is also his job to help in making policies so that country sees good growth and GDP increases. Without increase in GDP revenue do not increase and no country can develop without revenue. Here is record of Pakistan tax revenue:

http://www.sbp.org.pk/ecodata/tax.pdf

This is state of federal revenue during Nawaz period, before President Musharraf took over:
1996-97: Rs 282 bn ($6.9 bn @ Rs 41 = $)
1997-98: Rs 293 bn ($6.4 bn @ Rs 46 = $)
1998-99: Rs 308 bn ($5.7 bn @ Rs 54 = $)

Increase of Rs 26 billion or 9.2 percent in 2 years @ 4.5 percent a year. This increase was actually huge decline in real terms as inflation was very high during this period. Revenue also decreased in dollar terms as rupee kept devaluing fast during this period.

After Musharraf but before M Abdullah Yousuf took over as FBR chairman:
1998-99: Rs 308 bn ($5.7 bn @ Rs 54 = $)
2003-04: Rs 520 bn ($8.95 bn @ Rs 58 = $)

Increase of Rs 212 bn or 69 percent in 5 years @11.1 percent a year. This increase was substantial in real terms as inflation was very low during this period. Increase was reasonable in dollar terms too. During this period, value of rupee on average was around Rs 58 to a dollar.

After M Abdullah Yousuf took over as FBR chairman:
2003-04: Rs 520 bn ($8.95 bn @ 58 = $)
2007-08: Rs 1002 bn ($15.9 bn @ 63 = $)

Increase of Rs 482 bn or 93 percent in 4 years @ 17.9 percent a year. This increased was substantial in real terms as inflation was slightly higher than 1999-2004, but increase in percentage of revenue collection was much higher. Pakistan also saw huge economical growth during this period (GDP on average increased at over 7 percent a year). Increase in dollar terms is similar to increase in rupee terms as dollar exchange rate was constant at around Rs 60 to a dollar most of the time.

Now, some Pakistanis complain that why Pakistan never progresses and blame on government officials that they are corrupt and do not work for the country but work for themselves. These Pakistanis do not see or think that for people to work for the country; those on jobs not only need security, respect and acknowledgement, but should know that their works are rewarded.

In well managed countries, political appointments are mostly at ministerial level. People in government jobs running the country stay same but policy changes with change in political setup having different political values and directions. No one get effected as favouritism and nepotism do not play any role in appointments or sacking of anyone in government jobs.

Fortunately when there is military government in Pakistan, rulers do not have favourites and whoever works get security, respect, acknowledgment as well as rewards. Commitments from rulers can be seen in the country, corruption and nepotism get reduced, chaotic situation get reduced, order and direction can be seen at most places, and so people work hard and country develops fast.

Unfortunately when crook and corrupt political thugs take over, hard work do not matter even for those in government jobs, as favouritism and nepotism overshadows everything. Appointments and promotions does not take into account performance neither performances give any security to anyone. Connections become currency of promotion, appointments, as well as security in government jobs. So, it is understandable that government officials instead of working for country work for themselves and their political masters, knowing that their work or even good of the country is immaterial.


Here is report of chairman FBR getting sacked: Read and think:

FBR chief sacked on way to Russia for customs talks -DAWN - Top Stories; July 24, 2008
FBR chief sacked on way to Russia for customs talks
By Mubarak Zeb Khan

ISLAMABAD, July 23: The government sacked Federal Board of Revenue chairman M. Abdullah Yousuf on Wednesday and appointed Board of Investment Secretary Ahmed Waqar to succeed him.

Mr Yousuf, who was one of the important economic managers of the previous government, was removed from the post in an unceremonious way. He is in Geneva as member of an official delegation to the WTO ministerial meeting and was scheduled to leave for Moscow on Wednesday for talks with Russian officials on customs cooperation.

On Tuesday, he was made member of a committee to recommend ways for reducing the impact of international oil prices on economy.

According to a notification issued by the establishment division, the services of Mr Yousuf as chairman of the FBR and secretary general revenue were terminated with immediate effect.

Ahmad Waqar, a BS-22 officer of the secretariat group, has been given the additional charge of the revenue division. He will take over his new assignment on Thursday.

Mr Waqar was removed from the post of finance secretary by the caretaker government on charges of alleged inefficiency.

Mr Yousuf, who held additional charge of secretary general revenue, was among the four trusted economic managers of President Pervez Musharraf. All of them have been eased out. The other three are Export Promotion Bureau chairman Tariq Ikram, deputy chairman of the Planning Commission Dr Akram Shaikh and finance secretary Dr Waqar Masood.

Just three days before the completion of its five-year term in November last year, the PML-Q-led government had granted a three-year extension to Mr Yousuf, who turned 60 in March of this year. The extension was granted to ensure continuity of the World Bank-funded reforms project for tax administration which was expected to be completed next year.

An accountant by profession, Mr Yousuf also served as director finance and managing director of the Utility Stores Corporation and secretary of the Board of Investment, ministry of industry and the Privatisation Commission. He worked as secretary of the ministry of petroleum and natural resources for five years.

He was inducted into the unified regular cadre of the secretariat group in BPS-22 in 2006 and was subsequently declared the senior-most federal secretary, followed by his elevation to the post of secretary general.

When Mr Yousuf took charge of the FBR in 2004, the revenue collection was Rs518.8 billion, which increased to over Rs1,002 billion in 2007-08.
sobank
QUOTE(Ghias @ Jul 25 2008, 01:58 AM) *
Abdullah Yousuf is the same guy who goes thumak thumak in this youtube video.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=xU9Damy4cEk

Good riddance. Now he can return to his actual profession.



First of all thumak thumak doesnt mean he is khusra as you implying. But even if he is, I would rather have efficient khusra as a chief rather than lazy a$$ stud.
THE FIGHTING FALCON
Doesnt come as a surprise...Zardari would fire anyone who disagrees with him or would appoint anyone who helped him in his quest for becoming Mr.10 percent!! they removed Munir Akram too!! I know for a fact that this diplomat was a higly competent and patriotic individual whose team of young Pakistanis had done so well that the Americans had gotten sick of em!! The first strike came as Hussain Haqqani-A NeoCon Zionist-was appointed the ambassador and the second one comes now!
platinum786
Great, we send him to Russia and then fire him.

what's even funnier, nobody is concerned about the official decorum of leaving for Russia as a government minister and arriving as a nobody.

Rather the concern is about him dancing. People make fols of themselves all the time in public, we've all done it, even if it's a little thing. So what?! Does that make you a bad person or an incompetent person? Western politicans would love such opertunities to present themselves as down to earth. It's called PR... whats wrong with what he is doing?

It's all really beside the point, not only have we embarrsed ourselves in front of the Russians, we have got rid of another competent person.
Ghias
QUOTE(Salim @ Jul 27 2008, 05:31 AM) *
Please, Come on ... do not stoop so low to go below the belt. What Abdullah Yousuf was doing in function is nothing to do with his professional job neither his enjoying himself should be cause for concern. Actually, it is these people who can enjoy their time when relaxed give most output when working. Else, we have many Retards in Pakistan who look for enjoyment of 70 Virgins after death by committing suicide and killing innocent others along with themselves. Well, we also have crooks in Pakistan who enjoy their life at the expense of Nation. For instance, Nawaz who go for hair transplant so that to grow hair on his ganja head from stolen money of Pakistani poor, and Zardari who feeds his horses Apple Jam from stolen money of Pakistani poor. These days, mentioned two pathetic crooks (NS and AAZ) are enjoying their life at the expense of Pakistani poor, by doing world tour and making decision for Pakistan from various hotels of foreign countries ... paid by Pakistan, even when these two are not even part of Parliament.

As for personal life, youtube, and morality, then we have present Prime Minister 'Yousuf Raza Gillani' who deserves getting sacked most, as we can see him playing with tits of his co-political leader 'Sherry Rahman'. We also see Pakistani future King Bilawal whose picture is all around drunk and fallen on the shoulders of his girlfriend. We even have movies of BB swimming and sitting in swimming costume in public and Imran ex-girlfriend Sita White asking Imran to fulfil his paternal duty towards his illegitimate daughter. Well, if one start paparazzi career in Pakistan then we would find that most of our top politicians, beard and non-beard, are all morally flat. As for Abdullah Yousuf, what he was doing was just passing time gesture and nothing else.


Please understand that I'm not suporting NS, Ghaddari, Gilani or Bilawal or anyone else. I dont want to repeat myself so please read posts 8 and 11.

QUOTE(sobank @ Jul 27 2008, 05:36 AM) *
First of all thumak thumak doesnt mean he is khusra as you implying. But even if he is, I would rather have efficient khusra as a chief rather than lazy a$ stud.


QUOTE(platinum786 @ Jul 27 2008, 08:03 AM) *
Great, we send him to Russia and then fire him.

what's even funnier, nobody is concerned about the official decorum of leaving for Russia as a government minister and arriving as a nobody.

Rather the concern is about him dancing. People make fols of themselves all the time in public, we've all done it, even if it's a little thing. So what?! Does that make you a bad person or an incompetent person? Western politicans would love such opertunities to present themselves as down to earth. It's called PR... whats wrong with what he is doing?

It's all really beside the point, not only have we embarrsed ourselves in front of the Russians, we have got rid of another competent person.


I'm not implying that he's a khusra and I'm not supporting kicking him out while on official foreign tour.

For God sake people! stop jumping on someone before reading the whole thread. You guys have totally missed the point!! hitwall.gif hitwall.gif
iCe-b0mB
i guess easiest way to fire someone is when he or she is abroad on official mission .... reminds me of Nawaz sacking Musharaf

What ever he did after 5:00 pm i honestly don't give a damn, as a citizen of Pakistan what i care for is what he does between 9:00 am - 5:00 pm and in my opinion he worked his ass off

must7
I'm not implying that he's a khusra and I'm not supporting kicking him out while on official foreign tour.

For God sake people! stop jumping on someone before reading the whole thread. You guys have totally missed the point!!


Ghias .. sorry for the joint frenzy attack .. actually due to short scarce good economic news, when you are faced with daily debacles .. people start to loose faith in democratic structures ..

I remember how zealous Pakistani population was vis-a-vis coming of Zardari & NS .. but after the honeymoon of 4 months they too have become weary like Justice Ramday .. as the previous setup even when all ills were put on the shoulders of Gen. Musharaff but the end result was much better than today ! & the worst part is it is not like we can surivive for another 5 years on the earnings of last 8 years ! Our pockets are getting drained by days ..


You can imagine in such type of conditions how a Pakistani loving person will get upset when he hears similar economic debacles !
Shehz
QUOTE(Mangla @ Jul 26 2008, 12:54 PM) *
Yep if the dicision to fire him was based on the youtube video. I agree with the order. wacko.gif

They should have all got fired and trampled to death by a horse. tongue4.gif

At the UN
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=SsLFGGO6_f0...feature=related

Various dancing politicians

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=9WqQL5WFN20


Even former Pakistani Ambassador Maleeha Lodhi was seen and photographed dancing at a function (in US), Benazir didn't fire her.
Crown Prince of Spain danced after Spain beat Italy in the Euro Cup Semi's.
Prince William and Harry dance all the time.

All the above danced when decorum should have been maintained.
Yusuf danced close to midnight, and he is supposed to maintain decorum then?

QUOTE(Ghias @ Jul 27 2008, 05:07 AM) *
You guys have totally missed the point!! hitwall.gif hitwall.gif

On the contrary, you tried to justify your earlier post by saying that he shouldn't have danced at a private function.
yeah it was private, just because Pres and Pm are invited, doesn't make it official.

On my brother's wedding, both the Governor and President came, it was not an official visit.
Mangla
QUOTE(Shehz @ Jul 27 2008, 04:39 PM) *
Even former Pakistani Ambassador Maleeha Lodhi was seen and photographed dancing at a function (in US), Benazir didn't fire her.
Crown Prince of Spain danced after Spain beat Italy in the Euro Cup Semi's.
Prince William and Harry dance all the time.

All the above danced when decorum should have been maintained.
Yusuf danced close to midnight, and he is supposed to maintain decorum then?
On the contrary, you tried to justify your earlier post by saying that he shouldn't have danced at a private function.
yeah it was private, just because Pres and Pm are invited, doesn't make it official.

On my brother's wedding, both the Governor and President came, it was not an official visit.


Hope people relised I was kidding, thats why I showed other politicians dancing. Maybe people was not sure I was joking because sarcasm was not bracked at side of setence.

Shehz
I knew you were being sarcarstic.
Imran Khan danced on NFAK's song after World Cup win, he should be totally declared so so inelligible by EC to ever contest elections.

You can only contest if you hijack planes and kill people, not if you dance!
BTW, Yusuf was not a politician, he was an employee, so it would totally justify now for our bosses to fire us if we're seen dancing in discotheques.
instantexcess
Yousaf is a "grade 21 or grade 22" Officer or Afsar.

He cannot be "Fired" as such. Only his appointment can be changed.

He was heading FBR here, his next appointment would automatically come as #1 or #2 in some other govt. institute.

The only thing that has happned here is favourtisim, where Zardari/nawaz installed their own boy.


These are political appointments.


90s are upon us
instantexcess
btw, its sad that see that other than one dance from Yousaf ..... Ghias has no other argument.

Nothing on his curroption or nepotisim or favourtisim or questionable character, just one dance episode. talk about blind hate and illogical thought process.
Ghias
QUOTE(Shehz @ Jul 28 2008, 03:39 AM) *
Even former Pakistani Ambassador Maleeha Lodhi was seen and photographed dancing at a function (in US), Benazir didn't fire her.
Crown Prince of Spain danced after Spain beat Italy in the Euro Cup Semi's.
Prince William and Harry dance all the time.

All the above danced when decorum should have been maintained.
Yusuf danced close to midnight, and he is supposed to maintain decorum then?

QUOTE(Shehz @ Jul 28 2008, 04:02 AM) *
I knew you were being sarcarstic.
Imran Khan danced on NFAK's song after World Cup win, he should be totally declared so so inelligible by EC to ever contest elections.

You can only contest if you hijack planes and kill people, not if you dance!
BTW, Yusuf was not a politician, he was an employee, so it would totally justify now for our bosses to fire us if we're seen dancing in discotheques.


QUOTE
On the contrary, you tried to justify your earlier post by saying that he shouldn't have danced at a private function.
yeah it was private, just because Pres and Pm are invited, doesn't make it official.

On my brother's wedding, both the Governor and President came, it was not an official visit.

Khuda ka naam lo bhai. I specifically said that marriage's and mehndi are personal affair. That was an official seminar. You don't seem to know the difference between people attending shadi's, people celebrating after winning a football or cricket match , people attending balls and people attending official seminars!! hitwall.gif


QUOTE(instantexcess @ Jul 28 2008, 05:11 AM) *
Yousaf is a "grade 21 or grade 22" Officer or Afsar.

He cannot be "Fired" as such. Only his appointment can be changed.

He was heading FBR here, his next appointment would automatically come as #1 or #2 in some other govt. institute.

wtf1.gif wtf1.gif Post #11:
QUOTE
There is a huge difference between contract and permanent employees in Pakistan. Permanent guys are very hard to kick out and normally when higher ups are really pissed off with them they just transfer them or make them OSD or give them warning or a show cause notice but actually kicking out a permanent government employee is nearly impossible without very solid reasons. People normally head for courts when higher ups try sack them so it is usually avoided as the matter becomes complicated and courts get involved. Employees get stay orders and all sh*t hits the fan. It became a bit easy after Mushy introduced Ordinance 2000 but its still very tough.

But its exactly opposite for contract employees. Normally in Pakistan their contracts say that they can be sacked without any reason given and cannot complain and cannot go to any court. When they are sacked they stay sacked and there ain't nothing they can do about it and it is absolutely in accordance with the constitution and law of Pakistan. It gives every employer the right to offer the jobs on its term and both parties that are the employer and the employee agree on it before starting. Abdullah Yousuf retired a few years ago and was on extension now i.e. contract.


Read before you post!!!! hitwall.gif hitwall.gif

QUOTE
The only thing that has happned here is favourtisim, where Zardari/nawaz installed their own boy.


These are political appointments.


90s are upon us


I totally agree with this statement.

QUOTE(instantexcess @ Jul 28 2008, 05:12 AM) *
btw, its sad that see that other than one dance from Yousaf ..... Ghias has no other argument.

Nothing on his curroption or nepotisim or favourtisim or questionable character, just one dance episode. talk about blind hate and illogical thought process.


Whats really sad is that you're just continuing your rhetoric without listening to the other party.

BTW Thanks for giving me another line to think about. After just one google search I have found some interesting facts about everyones beloved Abdullah Yousuf's "corruption, nepotism, favoritism and questionable character".

Here:


MASSIVE CORRUPTION BY ABDULLAH YOUSUF

Below is report about many acts of corruption of most notorious dacoit member of Musharraf Gang, Abdullah Yousuf, well known as 'Chorman' of FBR or 'budha kanjar'.


BRIEF HISTORY AND BACKGROUND
Like many other carpetbaggers, this congenital crook returned from UK after lost his accountant job due to dishonesty. By contacts and payments, he get appointment as MD Utility Stores. But within few years, due to rampant corruption and mismanagement, USC was almost bankrupted.

He again used contacts and payments to avoid punishment. He was rewarded with more lucrative post of Secretary Petroleum. There his corruption became legendary. Even Peoples Party made reference to NAB against his misdeeds. Reference is available on PPP website. Investigations were started by NAB, but he and Shoukat Aziz got the investigations shelved after payments to concerned quarters.

Then he got posting as Chairman FBR in 2004. Here he became well known as most corrupt chairman in history, with nickname of \'Chorman\'.


MAJOR FRAUDS COMMITED BY ABDULLAH YOUSUF

MOBILE PHONE COMPANIES SCAM
As soon as he joined FBR, he reduced tax on mobile phones. Earlier, due to heavy smuggling, custom duty and sales tax on mobile phones was charged as activation stage tax of Rs. 2000. But after receiving hefty bribe from mobile phone companies, he reduced that tax to 500, and then 0. Benefit to mobile companies was Rs. 2 billion. He got 10% commission.


SALES TAX REFUNDS FRAUDS
During 2004 to 2006, many huge frauds of refund of sales tax occurred in connivance with officers posted by Abdullah Yousuf by establishing fake companies, issuing fake invoices and getting illegal refunds. Biggest sales tax refund scams of Bawan Shah, Asif Sonara, Jhangra, etc. were happen in his tenure in which he earned billions of rupees which he share with Shoukat Aziz and Musharraf.


BAWAN SHAH FRAUD
Abdullah Yousuf was partner of Raja Zarat (Bawan Shah Group) who was once just clerk in customs department. Their friendship started after Raja Zarat recover Abdullah Yousuf's daughter who elope with boyfriend. They maintained together accounts in Malaysia and Dubai. Their friendship was so strong that he delayed funeral of his mother till arrival of Raja Zarat. In 2005, Abdullah Yousuf inaugurated Shifa Eye Hospital of Raja Zarat in Karachi. Later, after Raja Zaraat arrested, he sent customs officers to remove inauguration plate from hospital. But, photographs and videos of inauguration are still available.

He use to transfer Collectors and other officers on recommendation of Raja Zarat. Raja Zarat was so powerful that even Collectors use to receive him at door of his car and did not dare talk in front of him. He openly supported Raja Zarat for sanction of his illegal refunds of Rs. 4 billion. He directed the Collectors to pay his refund quickly out of que. He directed Collector DTRE to give him DTRE in a single day. Their statements are on record in Directorate of Customs Intelligence and NAB. But then erupted a dispute between Abdullah Yousuf and Raja Zarat on money matters and thus he arrested him through Customs Intelligence.

To hide his crime, Abdullah Yousuf started involving sales tax persons with NAB, and cases were registered against more than 100 officers and staff. But all evidences about direct involvement of Abdullah Yousuf are available in NAB and Directorate Intelligence, Karachi. Statement and video of Raja Zarat is also on record about clear involvement of Abdullah Yousuf.


PAY PHONE SCAM
Mastermind of this scam was Sheraz Ahmed DC. He got involved some senior officers, who under pressure of telephone calls and threats by Abdullah Yousuf made illegal refund payments of millions of rupees to pay phone companies. Major chunk of kickback was given to Abdullah Yousuf by Sheraz Ahmed DC. Later, when the case was exposed, the senior officers were suspended and charge-sheeted, But Sheraz Ahmed was allowed to go on deputation to the Sindh Govt. This NOC was issued by FBR in June 2006, when the whole FBR remains busy in budget exercise and no transfer is even discussed. It shows interest of Abdullah Yousuf to protect his person.


CARE SYSTEM SCAM
Biggest fraud committed is through CARE system, which has not yet fully uncovered. CARE system was prepared mainly by Azhar Majeed Khalid Project Director, Ashir Azeem Gill Additional, Irfan Sarfraz DC and Omar Shafiq AC. Company who given contract for software was PWC, now Agility, has no experience in customs but only warehousing and trucking. Already available customs software used in many world countries like Asycuda was ignored. Azhar Majeed Khalid is owner of Atv channel., Ashir Azeem Gill has properties in Canada. Omar Shafiq poses as molvi but is most corrupt person and relative of notorious clearing agent Sharjeel who made crores of rupees in few months from CARE.

CARE system is full of defects which used by unscrupulous traders and corrupt officials to evade customs duties, clear banned items and obtain illegal refunds. Huge quantities of electronics, liqueur, cosmetics, fabrics, vehicles, auto parts and many other items were cleared though CARE due to manipulations by above named officers in connivance with Abdullah Yousuf. At least Rs.6 billion loss caused every year.

There is no audit since more than 3 years. Abdullah Yousuf tried his level best to roll out this defective CARE system to all ports, dry ports and airports of Pakistan, by giving contract of US $ 100 million to foreign company Agility Logistics. For kickback of $5 million, he made all efforts to awarded contract for 15 years before he leaving office.


ALLOWED HUGE SALES TAX EVASION BY STOPPING AUDIT
He stopped all audits of sales tax, thus allowing full-scale evasion of sales tax. He also removed all checks and balances in the sales tax law, so that his supporting companies could easily evade tax without fear. There was no audit since 2004, and companies are evading sales tax openly.


MASSIVE SMUGGLING AFTER REMOVAL OF CUSTOM CHECKPOSTS
In connivance with big smugglers, he removed all border checkposts, allowing massive smuggling and loss of billions of rupees revenue. He is known friend of big smugglers of Quetta, Peshawar and Sost.


INCOME TAX FRAUDS
He started complete self-assessment of Income Tax, without proper plan for audit, allowing big evasions.

During his tenure, mega-frauds in refund of Witholding Tax occurred. Illegal refunds were made by income tax officers who purchased expensive property in the UK. A scam was unearthed in Lahore where bogus refunds were issued during 2004-07 involving Rs. 103 million in 39 cases on forged documents. As usual, when these cases were detected, disciplinary action was taken against subordinate officers and staff although such refunds were issued under his threats and telephone calls.


NEPOTISM
He appointed his relative Abdul Razzak as Member Audit on huge pay package M-1, although he does not know even the ABC of tax audit. He had the reputation of having the 'magical hands' and could get anything approved from the Chorman.

Most of the lucrative postings and transfers were made on sifarish and recommendation instead of on merit. Even now, many of officers on most lucrative posts are sifirshi of Choudhry Shujaat and other politicians of previous government through Abdullah Yousuf.


TAX AMNESTY SCAM
Recently, Chorman again served his masters by issuing Tax Amnesty Scam. All the black money from tax evasion, smuggling and corruption of past eight years is to be made white by paying merely 2% on self-declared value of assets. This is big gift from Abdullah Yousuf to those who made millions and billions black money during past 'golden age of profits'. That is why businessman community is supporting him. He allowed open tax evasion as bribe to them.


OTHER
He is biggest supporter of Musharraf, and only loyal to him. A famous video available on internet where he is drunk and dancing for Musharraf and Shoukat Aziz. He paid Rs. 4 billion per year to his bosses to stay in his post. He gave a false affidavit against Chief Justice Iftikhar Muhammad Choudry. He is enemy of democratic government. He claims to achieve targets, but it was all actually due to lot of aid and US dollars coming into Pakistan. Tax-GDP ratio is still less than 10%, which shows his inefficiency. In fact, he destroyed tax machinery in name of reforms, and lot of money given by World Banks for reforms was misused and wasted.

These all facts are brought to your notice to take action against notorious, corrupt \'Chorman\' FBR Abdullah Yousuf. He should immediately arrested and prosecuted to stop further loss to country. His name must put on ECL. NAB reference about corruption in Petroleum Ministry should be reopen. And he should be recovered billions of rupees he took illegally, which he keeping in foreign accounts.


http://www.dictatorshipwatch.com/modules.p...r=0&thold=0


This is so much material that I'm having difficulty highlighting important points. Every point is important so I've decided not to highlight. This guy is is actually stuck with NAB because of his corruption!!!

One more thing, Please read what I have posted before tripping over yourselves in a haste to reply!!!
must7
Ghias ...

MOBILE PHONE COMPANIES SCAM
As soon as he joined FBR, he reduced tax on mobile phones. Earlier, due to heavy smuggling, custom duty and sales tax on mobile phones was charged as activation stage tax of Rs. 2000. But after receiving hefty bribe from mobile phone companies, he reduced that tax to 500, and then 0. Benefit to mobile companies was Rs. 2 billion. He got 10% commission.


Ghias . : I do not know from where you got this compiled report against the guy .. however, in the short time available the first one, which you mention I would like to point out to you :

That firstly in place of earlier times the Mobile Phone companies have paid (both Telenor & Warid) US $ 249 million for their 7 year licenses, whereas earlier Mobilink, Ufone & Pak!! had paid "0".

Due to removal of the Rs. 2,000 tax .. it is a known fact that Pakistani mobile phone subsribers incrased 5 folds annually and it is regarded as one of the most increasing & economy boosting act of the previous govt.

Also don't forget that today on every card you buy .. you are paying tax. So in fact in place of upfront Rs. 2,000 / mobile phone, people are paying to Govt. a sales tax on card sold ! You should check this figures.

Coming back after Telenor & Warid, in the next year Mobilink also had to pay US $ 249 million for the renewal.

The rest of the claims .. I don't know and cannot write in detail as time is short for me especially at the end of the months !
platinum786
As an educated person, I am amazed that you consider information from a website called dictatorship watch as impartial and factual. Do you know how easy it is to create a website? It is all speculation without any evidence.
Ghias
QUOTE(platinum786 @ Jul 28 2008, 02:35 PM) *
As an educated person, I am amazed that you consider information from a website called dictatorship watch as impartial and factual. Do you know how easy it is to create a website? It is all speculation without any evidence.

All speculation without evidence? You are an experienced person Platinum, you know as well as I do that these kind of allegations don't just meta realize out of thin air. There is always something cooking under the carpet and when it get unbearable, facts like these come out. example: Do you have any evidence against any of our politicians of their looting of Pakistan? No!! but everybody still knows.

This guy actually has a pending case against him in capacity of Secretary Petroleum which he remained for 6 long years. http://www.dawn.com/2006/05/16/top5.htm

You can dismiss anything you like and I can't do anything about it but it won't change the facts. After proving that he's a thug and a crook and one of the most corrupt bureaucrat of the era, a guy whose appointment in grade 22 was illegal (see below), a guy who was investigated by NAB and still has a case pending, a guy who bent the laws to retain government houses and defied other people their right (see below), after at least proving that he is a guy of questionable character who kicked the thing called official decorum in the balls to remain in the good books of Mushy thinking that it would somehow reinforce his label as an en lighted Muslim in an official gathering and he's a guy who illegally got the seat of Chairman CBR,,,,,,
if you still don't want to see the light of the day then I rest my case.


"The wages of promotion

BS-22 officer asked to refund
additional pay since June 1998

By Ansar Abbasi

ISLAMABAD: At least 49 serving federal secretaries would figure below the newly, but controversially, inducted BS-22 officer of the Secretariat Group Abdullah Yusuf because of his backdated appointment by the prime minister.

Yusuf, who has been previously enjoying management grade-I, has been asked to refund the additional pay that he has been drawing with effect from June 1, 1998, the date of his induction. Management grade-I offers more salary as compared to BS-22.

A government spokesman said while approving his retrospective induction, the competent authority has asked to get the differential pay refunded from the officer with effect from his date of induction. Yusuf's is the first ever case of induction in BS-22 in any of the civil service groups since their creation.

When contacted, Yusuf said he would refund whatever is the differential amount. Maintaining his known decency, he did not sound bitter to what was reported about him in The News on Thursday. He rather politely said, "You have done your job, I don't mind it."

Because of his backdated induction, which is illegal but the government does not see anything wrong with it, Yusuf will appear on top of all 49 federal secretaries presently representing the Secretariat Group.

According to a source, besides the controversial induction, the backdated appointment is in contravention of a Supreme Court ruling that had set the principle that induction, even where allowed, could not be made retrospectively.

Interestingly, this new controversy of BS-22 induction has hit the bureaucracy at a time when some of the federal secretaries are already contesting why their names have been included in the Secretariat Group instead of the service/group they originally belonged to.

Although the Secretariat Group office memorandum has the provision to make secretaries in the group while promoting officers of BS-21 from other services and groups, some of the officers so promoted contest that they should have been promoted in their own group/cadre. They argue that the government could not change their group/service without their consent.

The new development, it is believed, would further this controversy amid unconfirmed reports that the government might create a few positions of secretary general in the bureaucracy. In such case, the seniority of the federal secretary would matter a lot.

Before Yusuf's induction in the Secretariat Group, Ejaz Rahim, secretary cabinet, was the senior most among secretaries. He got BS-22 on 15-5-2000. Now Yusuf, by getting the seniority in BS-22 of 1998, will supersede even Rahim.

The other secretaries in the Secretariat Group, who will figure below Yusuf, include Shafqat Ezdi Shah, secretary local government; Tasneem Noorani, secretary commerce; Khalid Mehmood, chairman Bank of Punjab; Tariq Farooq, secretary parliamentary affairs; Maj ® Muhammad Naeen Khan, former chief secretary Balochistan; Syed Anwar Mehmood, secretary health; Dr Waqar Masood Khan, special secretary PM Sectt; Muhammad Shakil Durrani, secretary railways; Syed Masood Alam Rizvi, chairman trading corporation of Pakistan; Kh Zaheer Ahmed, secretary scientific and technology research; Maj (retd) Khalid Latif, OSD; Maj (retd) Syed Kamal Shah, secretary interior; Maj (retd) M Fazal Durrani, chairman Pakistan insurance corporation; Khalid Saeed, secretary economic affairs division; Kamran Rasool, chief secretary Punjab; M Shuja Shah, executive director World Bank; Zahiruddin Babar, secretary Wafaqi Mohtasib; Javed Sadiq Malik, principal secretary to PM; Dr Sheikh Aleem Mehmood, OSD; Salim Gul Sheikh, secretary tourism; Syed Jalil Abbas, secretary culture; Ahmad Waqar, secretary petroleum; Ijaz Ahmed Qureshi, chief secretary NWFP; Ghias Uddin; Tariq Mehmood, secretary communications; Muhammad Jamil, secretary minorities; M Humayun Farshori, secretary planning and development; M Jehangir Bashar, secretary board of investment; Syed Bilal Ahmed, special secretary finance (military); Syed Mohsin Asad, secretary tax ombudsman; Syed Safdar Javed, senior member board of revenue Punjab; Mohammad Ismail Qureshi, secretary food; Sajid Hassan, secretary education; Sajid Hussain Chattha, secretary states and frontier regions; Ismail Niazi, secretary narcotics control; Muhammad Aslam Sinjarani, secretary labour and overseas; Abdur Rauf Chaudhry, secretary housing; Suhail Safdar, secretary women; Mohsin Hafeez, secretary president secretariat; Suleman Ghani, secretary industries, Rasul Bux Baloch, secretary Kashmir affair and Northern Areas; Shahid Rafi, secretary information; Suleman Siddiq, principal secretary finance and taxation Punjab; Subtain Fazle Haleem, chairman planning and development; K B Rind, chief secretary Balochistan; and Tanvir Ali Agha, special secretary finance."


http://www.jang.com.pk/thenews/jul2005-dai.../main/main3.htm

Holy cows that don't move for others.


QUOTE(must7 @ Jul 28 2008, 02:22 PM) *
Ghias ...

MOBILE PHONE COMPANIES SCAM
As soon as he joined FBR, he reduced tax on mobile phones. Earlier, due to heavy smuggling, custom duty and sales tax on mobile phones was charged as activation stage tax of Rs. 2000. But after receiving hefty bribe from mobile phone companies, he reduced that tax to 500, and then 0. Benefit to mobile companies was Rs. 2 billion. He got 10% commission.


Ghias . : I do not know from where you got this compiled report against the guy .. however, in the short time available the first one, which you mention I would like to point out to you :

That firstly in place of earlier times the Mobile Phone companies have paid (both Telenor & Warid) US $ 249 million for their 7 year licenses, whereas earlier Mobilink, Ufone & Pak!! had paid "0".

Due to removal of the Rs. 2,000 tax .. it is a known fact that Pakistani mobile phone subsribers incrased 5 folds annually and it is regarded as one of the most increasing & economy boosting act of the previous govt.

Also don't forget that today on every card you buy .. you are paying tax. So in fact in place of upfront Rs. 2,000 / mobile phone, people are paying to Govt. a sales tax on card sold ! You should check this figures.

Coming back after Telenor & Warid, in the next year Mobilink also had to pay US $ 249 million for the renewal.

The rest of the claims .. I don't know and cannot write in detail as time is short for me especially at the end of the months !


Maybe you're right must bhai, but it doesn't prove that he didn't get bribes or 10% share. Don't you think when someone is insisting on a kind of serious allegation like this an inquiry should be launched and the person or persons being inquired should be made OSD till the outcome of the inquiry whatever may it be? according to regular government procedure? or should herds and herds of people attack the person making these allegations saying that these are all speculation without evidence? How dare you touch a holy cow like him?
Salim
Ghias bhai: Aap thora aqal istamaal kiya karo. When you read anything from anywhere, try to use the intelligence Allah has given to every person to work out if those allegations could be true or not. If you read that there is car that runs without any fuel or power source, would you believe it? If you read that a person became rich as he found money all around his bed that just appeared from nowhere, would you believe it? If you read that a Lion attacked a Rabbit but Rabbit killed and ate the Lion, would you believe it? Similarly, I could not believe most of the allegations you mentioned as they are mostly absurd when compared with reality. Reason:

If Abdullh Yousuf was as corrupt as you are trying to claim than how Pakistan Federal tax revenue kept increasing with leaps and bounds, both in rupee and dollar terms? This could only happen if Abdullah Yousuf was too good and regardless of corruption, FBR under his chairmanship managed to give best ever performance in Pakistan history ... or ... what you wrote is absurd and in reality Abdullah Yousuf was hard working and not corrupt. To me, even though I would not mind that he was corrupt as long as his performance result was good, still more logical to me is that, Abdullah Yousuf was not corrupt and that shows in his performance as chairman FBR (that is measurable).

Anyhow, you should also realise that at present we have Pakistan government full of liars and they are doing all sort of propaganda based on lies. Let me show you one of many such propaganda against Abdullah Yousuf and then prove it that it is based on lies.

Source: The Nation ... for some, this paper is obviously very reliable (to me, every Pakistani media is laughable).
Report: FBR Chairman axed while on visit to Russia
Reporter: Shahbaz Rana
Date: 24th July 2008.

http://www.nation.com.pk/pakistan-news-new...visit-to-Russia

QUOTE
ISLAMABAD - The government on Wednesday terminated the service contract of Chairman Federal Board of Revenue, Abdullah Yusuf, who is in Russia to negotiate a bilateral agreement. ...
...
...
The outgoing Chairman takes the credit of crossing Rs 1000 billion revenue collection barrier. When he took the charge, the annual revenue collection was around Rs 500 billion. The independent economists do not give him this credit due to Board’s reliance on indirect taxes.


Now think ... ‘The independent economists do not give him this credit due to Board’s reliance on indirect taxes’ ... Is this true or propaganda? Obviously, it is propaganda based on blatant lies.

Actually, it was obvious that during Abdullah Yousuf tenure, Federal tax revenue doubled and that is very good performance, but since most do not know what proportion of that tax was direct and what indirect, those doing propaganda based on blatant lies used this to misguide innocent people. It does not matter if tax is collected using direct or indirect taxations, but ... what is fact? If we would do some investigation, we would find that both direct and indirect taxes substantially increased during Abdullah Yousuf tenure and surprisingly, most increase was not in indirect taxations as report claims, but was in direct taxations.

Actually, direct taxes more than doubled as it increased by 135 percent in 4 years, from Rs 165 bn in 2004 to Rs 387 bn in 2008. Indirect taxes also increased substantially by 73 percent in 4 years, from Rs 356 bn in 2004 to Rs 615 bn in 2008. Indirect taxes would have increased more but government kept reducing tax rates on indirect taxes, so that economy can grow fast. Anyhow, these increases reflect competency of FBR plus results of booming economy ... and Abdullah Yousuf shares credit for both as he was Chairman of FBR as well as amongst people responsible for economical policies. That is the reason his contract was extended by 3 years in November 2008


If you want to see competency, than let compare two periods. One of Nawaz Shareef between 1997 and 1999 ... whereas other when Yousuf was Chief FBR, between 2004 and 2008. Here are the figures broken into direct and indirect taxes:

http://www.sbp.org.pk/ecodata/tax.pdf

Direct Taxes: Let compare direct taxes of Nawaz's corrupt and incompetent period with direct taxes during ex-chief of FBR, Abdullah Yousuf period:

Corrupt and Incompetent period of Nawaz Shareef (1997-1999):
1996-97: Rs 85 bn ($2.07 bn @ Rs 41 = $)
1997-98: Rs 103 bn ($2.24 bn @ Rs 46 = $)
1998-99: Rs 110 bn ($2.03 bn @ Rs 54 = $)

One can see that Nawaz period started with $2.07 bn and finished at $2.03 bn, showing decline in direct taxes when measured in dollars. Even in rupee, increase is 29 percent in 2 years, or on average, increase @13.5 percent each year.

Ex-chief of FBR, Abdullah Yousuf period (2004-2008):
2003-04: Rs 165 bn ($2.84 bn @ 58 = $)
2004-25: Rs 183 bn ($3.05 bn @ 60 = $)
2005-06: Rs 225 bn ($3.75 bn @ 60 =$)
2006-07: Rs 334 bn ($5.57 bn @ 60 =$)
2007-08P: Rs 387 bn ($6.15 bn @ 63 = $)

Figure shows that direct taxes kept increasing substantially in Rupee as well as in dollar terms every year. In four years, Federal direct tax revenue increased by around 135 percent, or on average @ 23.8 percent a year. This increase is much higher than increase in Federal indirect tax revenue ... and certainly much higher than average increase of 13.5 percent a year during Nawaz period. This improvement is in spite of very high inflation during 1997-99 compared to 2004-08 ... so, whose period was period of incompetency?


Indirect taxes: Let compare indirect taxes of Nawaz's corrupt and incompetent period with indirect taxes during ex-chief of FBR, Abdullah Yousuf period:

Corrupt and Incompetent period of Nawaz Shareef (1997-1999):
1996-97: Rs 197 bn ($4.8 bn @ Rs 41 = $)
1997-98: Rs 190 bn ($4.13 bn @ Rs 46 = $)
1998-99: Rs 198 bn ($3.66 bn @ Rs 54 = $)

One can see that Nawaz period started with $4.8 bn and finished at $3.66 bn, showing decline in direct taxes when measured in dollars. Even in rupee, increase is 0.5 percent in 2 years (from 197 bn to 198 bn), or on average, increase @ 0.25 percent each year (even less than 1 percent). Overall, federal tax revenue in terms of dollar decreased during Nawaz corrupt and incompetent period 1997-99.

Ex-chief of FBR, Abdullah Yousuf period (2004-2008):
2003-04: Rs 356 bn ($6.14 bn @ 58 = $)
2004-25: Rs 407 bn ($6.78 bn @ 60 = $)
2005-06: Rs 488 bn ($8.13bn @ 60 =$)
2006-07: Rs 513 bn ($8.55 bn @ 60 =$)
2007-08P: Rs 615 bn ($9.76 bn @ 63 = $)

Figure shows that direct taxes kept increasing substantially in Rupee as well as in dollar terms every year. In four years, Federal direct tax revenue increased by around 73 percent, or on average @ 14.7 percent a year. This increase is much lower than increase in Federal direct tax revenue during the period (that increased @23.8 percent a year) ... though obviously much higher than average increase of 0.25 percent a year during Nawaz period (when inflation was much higher in 1997-99 than 2004-2008 and rupee devaluation proves that ... as currency devalues when inflation is high) ... so, whose period was period of incompetency?

I hope that after all the figures with 'State Bank of Pakistan' reference, you should not believe that Abdullah Yousuf was sacked due to incompetency or because of corruption, as both incompetency as well as corruption can show in performance. We should realise that Abdullah Yousuf period was most competent period of FBR, unparallel in Pakistan history till now, that cannot be put down by baseless allegations of incompetency or corruption.
must7
Maybe you're right must bhai, but it doesn't prove that he didn't get bribes or 10% share. Don't you think when someone is insisting on a kind of serious allegation like this an inquiry should be launched and the person or persons being inquired should be made OSD till the outcome of the inquiry whatever may it be? according to regular government procedure? or should herds and herds of people attack the person making these allegations saying that these are all speculation without evidence? How dare you touch a holy cow like him?

Ghias Bro .. I am dead right about the mobile license problem, as every trick in the book was utilized to avoid the sale of the mobile phone license .. I remember it was claimed in the local newspapers that since Gen. Musharaff's US friend Gen. Zini's company was alos bidding, the whole process was to accomodate his company and that we should not be having 5 operators in the country including other country examples were given.

Even the default by another second bidder (Warid was 3rd) by virtue of which GOP got 10% of the bid bond was claimed to be a major loss to the GOP !

If that was not enough Mobilink claimed to go bankrupt if applied for the 249 million US$ license fee ... no wonder the number teleporting device installed to avoid any blackmail from existing operators ..

The point is at that time the doomsday scenaior which was shown and told in the media was surprising as at the end of the day we got nearly 600 million US $ and Gen. Zini's company's bid came 7th or 8th !

Today we are earning tax & revenue from the telecommunication industry but we seem to forget that at the time of sale everybody was talking opposite !
Mangla
Dictatorship watch. A valuable source? Ghia when you went to school did they teach history as a subject?
Shehz
Khuda ko maan yaar, bees bees paragraph key ab post na maar yaar.
This entire thread kicked off when you posted the below, and you follow up with Instant was a debate on if the function was private or official, revolving around dance as a decorum.

Ab aap apney stand ko salvage karney chaley ho bhai.
Ok, giving you a NRO, was Yusuf replaced by a more competent person?
Also Yusuf was originally retained to see if a certain project was completed, were there any corrective meassures taken before he was fired?
And his sacking was decided, then why do us, the Pakistani tax payers have to pay for his Russian trip?
Was his sacking justified, really?

NRO is still forwarded to you, but just a Refresher:
QUOTE(Ghias @ Jul 25 2008, 01:58 AM) *
Abdullah Yousuf is the same guy who goes thumak thumak in this youtube video.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=xU9Damy4cEk

Good riddance. Now he can return to his actual profession.

QUOTE(Ghias @ Jul 25 2008, 04:33 AM) *
Dude I don't support Nawaza or Ghaddari. Just check my signature or read my previous posts. All I'm trying to say is that there is no excuse for what he did. Come one, there's something called official decorum and everyone has to follow it. You can't just start dancing like he did.Dont give me the crap about it being a show or whatever. He was there in his official capacity and he should have maintained the decorum. If you're not aware of this then please don't talk about it. Official decorum in government organizations has to be rigidly maintained. The guy totally lost it that day just to show himself as an enlighted Muslim in front of Mushy. He was being a chamcha and he crossed all known limits of chmchaism on that day. Just sacking this guy is not going to cripple Pakistan. Organizations are not run by individuals otherwise KRL would been closed by now. No one is absolutely necessary. Maybe he was doing a good job in the office but that doesn't mean he's irreplaceable. Now I don't trust Ghadari and Nawaza gov. to revolutionize the org. etc etc. But this guy deserved to be sacked for his totally unprofessional behavior and breaking of official decorum and for gaining the title of the chamcha of the century.

aliJess
QUOTE(Mangla @ Jul 26 2008, 11:54 AM) *
Yep if the dicision to fire him was based on the youtube video. I agree with the order. wacko.gif

They should have all got fired and trampled to death by a horse. tongue4.gif

At the UN
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=SsLFGGO6_f0...feature=related

Various dancing politicians

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=9WqQL5WFN20


I know you are joking but just to comment 'how about our PM Gilani enjoying the boobs of sheri in a rally?'



bojangles
QUOTE(Ghias @ Jul 25 2008, 12:58 AM) *
Abdullah Yousuf is the same guy who goes thumak thumak in this youtube video.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=xU9Damy4cEk

Good riddance. Now he can return to his actual profession.



He was good at his job, that's all that matters. Though I agree, he is in a high position within the government, he should learn to not be an idiot when the cameras are around. Sacking him when hes outside of the country (on government business) is just low though.
Mangla
QUOTE(aliJess @ Jul 28 2008, 04:57 PM) *
I know you are joking but just to comment 'how about our PM Gilani enjoying the boobs of sheri in a rally?'


When there is a porn thread on PDF that will be posted first.
Ghias
QUOTE(Salim @ Jul 28 2008, 06:20 PM) *
I hope that after all the figures with 'State Bank of Pakistan' reference, you should not believe that Abdullah Yousuf was sacked due to incompetency or because of corruption, as both incompetency as well as corruption can show in performance. We should realise that Abdullah Yousuf period was most competent period of FBR, unparallel in Pakistan history till now, that cannot be put down by baseless allegations of incompetency or corruption.

I don't know whether to hitwall.gif or to CRY1.GIF . I have clearly stated that I don't believe that he was sacked due to incompetency or corruption. He was sacked just because PPP wanted to bring their man in, simple. And I don't support the cook NS!! hitwall.gif Please yaar read the whole thread before you post.

Tell me one thing though, how does all these statistics prove that he did not show favoritism or bent laws or nick money or was legally appointed without kicking his colleagues in the balls?

QUOTE(Mangla @ Jul 28 2008, 09:43 PM) *
Dictatorship watch. A valuable source? Ghia when you went to school did they teach history as a subject?

No, but they did teach me that ignoring serious allegations like these without proper investigation is stupidity of the highest degree and that everything should happen according to the law of the country. Weren't you taught this?

QUOTE(Shehz @ Jul 29 2008, 01:39 AM) *
Khuda ko maan yaar, bees bees paragraph key ab post na maar yaar.
This entire thread kicked off when you posted the below, and you follow up with Instant was a debate on if the function was private or official, revolving around dance as a decorum.

Ab aap apney stand ko salvage karney chaley ho bhai.
Ok, giving you a NRO, was Yusuf replaced by a more competent person?
Also Yusuf was originally retained to see if a certain project was completed, were there any corrective meassures taken before he was fired?
And his sacking was decided, then why do us, the Pakistani tax payers have to pay for his Russian trip?
Was his sacking justified, really?

NRO is still forwarded to you, but just a Refresher:

Ok yaar lets just end it. You are entitled to your opinion and I to mine.

IMHO,

1. Refer to post #11.

2. Who knows, maybe, maybe not.

3. This is yet another gift of PPP to the nation.

4. He was probably sacked for the wrong reasons. But that doesn't negate the fact that there was another reason to sack him too i.e breaking official decorum.

Peace out.
mdbao
QUOTE(Ghias @ Jul 29 2008, 12:11 AM) *
Tell me one thing though, how does all these statistics prove that he did not show favoritism or bent laws or nick money or was legally appointed without kicking his colleagues in the balls?



What so now its guilty unless proven innocence....come on man, you know better than me about posting such allegations from dictatorshipwatch.com
Mangla
Ghia

QUOTE
No, but they did teach me that ignoring serious allegations like these without proper investigation is stupidity of the highest degree and that everything should happen according to the law of the country. Weren't you taught this?


True but we cannot carry out a proper investigation. I was mentioning the website, obviously it has a aganda, we cannot say its impartial. If the website was not so biased then I will take my time to click website. Some of the accusations are pure speculation.
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